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What the German elections teach us

Submitted by Soren Dayton on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 06:52
in

 This weekend's German election has some lessons for our political context. Der Speigel sees a new German political pattern emerging from this:

After Sunday's election, Germany's political landscape has been shaken up, perhaps for ever. Angela Merkel's conservatives will be able to form a coalition government with the business-friendly FDP, but the balance of power between the two parties has fundamentally shifted. And the once-powerful Social Democrats may never recover from their defeat.

Chancellor Angela Merkel has probably saved her chancellorship -- but the price that her conservatives will have to pay for it is high. The election result for the center-right Christian Democratic Union (CDU) and its Bavarian sister party, the Christian Social Union (CSU), is lower than in 2005. Nevertheless, she can form a coalition government with the business-friendly Free Democratic Party because support for the FDP has increased in a way that until recently pollsters would scarcely have thought possible.

Just as in the European elections, we are seeing a splinter of the political scene. On the left, the far left gained, the Greens gain, the centrist-left collapsed, the center-right shrunk slightly, and the liberal party gained massively. The right (center-right + liberals) has grown, but not hugely.

Several things to take away from this in the time of an economic downturn:

First, the appeal of libertarian positions has grown. Even in Europe and Germany there has been an anti-government, anti-entitlement, pro-reform movement that is growing massively. We see this here in the tea party movement.

The response to the economic crisis has been more freedom and less government. Somehow government is getting the blame, at the ballot box, for the downturn.

Second, the center-left has lost credibility, but the numbers on the left are still large if you include the far-left. It is hard to imagine a victory of the German left without the Left Party, but it is also questionable whether this turns off swing voters between the center-right and center-left. Some on the American left will try to learn the lesson that they need to move to the left -- isn't that always the lesson? -- but one wonders if, like the SPD, the Democrats would suffer from highlighting their relationship with the far-left.

All in all, we are in a situation in which right-leaning parties are sweeping elections or performing at historic highs. These things happen in response to global events. It will be interesting to see if this pattern continues into the next year. 

 

 

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The FDP

Submitted by Mead50 on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 08:47.

received a grand total of 14.6% of the vote...about 2/3s of the total of the Social Democrats.

The situation as summed by a commenter on The Economist website.

The Economist isn't quite right about voters booting out the Grand Coalition. The fact is that the grand coalition is still the only coalition of two parties that got a majority of the popular vote. The Liberals and Conservatives together got just 48% of the vote, but the oddities of the German election system give them enough votes in the Bundestag to form a coalition. Since the Conservatives prefer working with the Liberals the liberals will go into the coalition with them. But strictly speaking the Socialists weren't voted out -- although they did have a terrible election.

I just don't think there is much in a German election that pertains to the American political scene.

Another Economist commenter put the FDP's success down to the personal popularilty of the FDP's leader, Guido Westerwelle, who is openly gay.

As one of Andrew Sullivan's readers put it:

But for a moment, let's celebrate that there are places in this world -- places like Germany -- where a gay man can be a fiscal conservative, a proponent of removing nuclear missiles from German soil, and a supporter of the war in Afghanistan.  I may disagree with him, but the fact that he exists routinely, normally, that his sexuality merits no comment...that's downright liberal.

 

Not really germane, is it?

Submitted by meechigan-matt on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 11:01.

I appreciate that some commenter on a blog of writer who is generally been discredited within the gay conservative movement would applaud a German gay leader who is a conservative, but what does that have to do with anything here?  Nothing.

Unfortunately in America and in the traditional pro-Democrat, pro-Left gay activist community, gays who hold conservative viewpoints are ridiculed almost as much as some of the Left trolls here criticize center-right views.  It's vicious.  It's almost a sport for traditional gay activists to label conservative or pro-Republican gays as uncle toms or jews-helping-Hitler.

It would remind fair readers here of the type of conduct that some Left trolls use to defame religion and religious people as "sky people" or "myth chasers".

Nonetheless, this comment from a commenter at a blog which is highly discredited in the gay conservative community isn't germane.  It isn't even on topic.  It is a vintage Left trolling exercise in action.  Let's try to advance the discussion a little or underscore the shortfalls/merits of someone's points instead of trying to sound erudite and mask one being as thick as a short plank.  Shall we?

Bravo

Submitted by Mead50 on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 11:26.

Nonetheless, this comment from a commenter at a blog which is highly discredited in the gay conservative community isn't germane.  It isn't even on topic.  It is a vintage Left trolling exercise in action.  Let's try to advance the discussion a little or underscore the shortfalls/merits of someone's points instead of trying to sound erudite and mask one being as thick as a short plank.  Shall we?

Quite possibly the funniest comment I've read here to date. Bravo!

Mead, I think someone named you the Village Idiot already

Submitted by meechigan-matt on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 11:49.

You might want to stop.  You keep proving their case each day.  "Thick as a short plank" trying to look erudite is the perfect sketch of you on your best day.  Sarcasm isn't your strong suit, either.

So you've opted to put down

Submitted by Mead50 on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 12:06.

the pipe and the smoking jacket and leave the book-lined study? Just as well...I didn't find that persona terribly convincing. Funny, yes - convincing, no.

Mead 50, will you ever make a germane comment?

Submitted by meechigan-matt on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 14:05.

Or is it your style on The Next Right to make petty, quibbling snark-ladened drive-by comments in the hope that you'll have the last word?

I thought only Keith Olberman did that?  Germane, Mead 50.  Try making an observation on your own, with your own thoughts, about the German election results and what that portends for the New Next Right in America.

One thinks that herding cats would be easier than getting you to stay on-task, admit the truth or make an apology when needed.  You've missed all three in the last five posts.

See the first comment under the OP.

Submitted by Mead50 on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 14:23.

Try making an observation on your own, with your own thoughts, about the German election results and what that portends for the New Next Right in America.

See the first comment under the OP.

  • the FDP got a whopping total of 14% of the vote, which is 2/3s of what the out-of-favor SDP party got;
  • the way German governments are formed means that minority parties can have more influence that parties that received larger vote totals
  • therefore there isn't much in a German election that pertains to the American political scene
  • the FDP's success could be down to the personal popularity of its leader
  • the fact that their leader is openly gay and no one cares further illustrates the extent to which one can only draw parallels to American politics by clutching at straws.

 

"One thinks"? So the smoking jacket is back on, old boy? A few minutes ago, when you were posting about "pure far Left partisan wet dreams" on another thread, did you forget what persona you supposed to be using?

Ahh, the anti-elitist returns fresh from a starring role as

Submitted by meechigan-matt on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 14:32.

the Village Idiot.

You are a tedious lot, Mead 50.  I don't own a smoking jacket but, speaking of smoking, I wonder what mixture you're using in your bong... it's the only way to explain you inability to speak germanely to the issue at hand and construct a sentence without bullet points.

Public high school graduate, I assume?

PS> glad you listened and dropped the sarcasm; you weren't convincing, in the least.

 

Very proud public school graduate

Submitted by Mead50 on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 14:54.

thank you for asking!

As for criticizing me for being anti-elitist: a) too funny; and b) I thought among your circles being anti-elitist would be seen as a good thing!

Sorry if that structure annoys you as much as bullet points do.

PS: I can be tedious, but I can't be a tedious lot, as there is only one of me. A fact for which I assume you will be forever grateful.

 

 

Public school graduate?

Submitted by meechigan-matt on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 15:15.

It was a rhetorical question that, by proof of your thinking expressed inartfully here, well demonstrates and wasn't intended to be answered.

Yes, Mead, you can be a tedious lot.  I simply wish you'd discuss issues more truthfully and with less talking-points mentality.  It's a big wish, one will grant you.

It must be true what they say about public schools.

Submitted by Mead50 on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 15:26.

Because I cannot make heads or tails of your first and last sentences.

My uncle used to use "thick as a short plank", it fits you Mead

Submitted by MI-GOPer on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 19:33.

I don't know about belittling someone with nasty, spiteful sounding snarkish sound bites like "smoking jacket" and "book-lined study" but I don't think sounding condescending to someone you accuse of being condescending is a good remedy, Mead 50.  Trying to cull others out of a pack by labeling them as elites doesn't work for conservatives or on conservatives, either.

In fact, in thread after thread, your comments are increasingly reduced to one of two things, both equally unconvincing to all outside your echo chamber... your comments are either 1) shallow and lack merit or 2) they are so far into the snarkish pettiness you're known for here and elsewhere that no one listens or comments except the party you're toying with, not discussing.  You're a gamer, Mead; insincere gamer.

Game-players, Mead, are a dime a dozen in this life; like salesmen, they're a necessary evil but no one wants to be around them at the end of the day --not the clients they milk, not the family or friends they abuse.  Game-players, Mead; you're one of them.  Thick as a short plank.

Please back up this thread

Submitted by Mead50 on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 20:23.

and locate the first use of nasty, spiteful language - surprise! It is from that "other" poster from Michigan.

I think this nailed it... you've been had, Mead

Submitted by MI-GOPer on Sat, 10/03/2009 - 21:01.

You're a gamer, Mead; insincere gamer

 

The Teabaggers?

Submitted by NMDem on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 12:00.

We see this here in the tea party movement.

Are you freakin' kidding us?  The Teabaggers are hardly a movement.  This is a farce, ginned up by corporate front groups like FreedomWorks.  The article in Rolling Stone this week merely codifies what everyone who cares to know  has known for weeks - the Teabagger town brawls were the creation of Dick Armey, Frank Luntz and Betsy McCaughey and paid for by big oil barons (David and Charles Koch) and health insurance lobbyists.  Movement.  More like a corporate bowel movement.  Give us a break!

 

Now the far Left here has gone from silly to "credible".

Submitted by MI-GOPer on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 12:56.

We've got Mead 50 quoting commenters at other websites as proof that Soren's premise if wrong and flawed.

Then, we've the ultimate windbag of NMDem referencing the far Left and modern culture's equivalent of the trash supermaket tabloid The Enquirer... it's an article in Rolling Stone?  What next, a DailyKos/Research 2000 "poll" telling us that only thoughtful, informed, highly educated people read Rolling Stone?  Then CLD2 can endlessly debate all that it isn't a Daily Kos poll, Research 2000 is legit and they do have more than one phone line... and Mead 50 can back him up with a quote from someone from The Enquirer blog telling all of us that we're victimizing trash supermarket tabloids... isn't that where Keith Olbernann started his "journalist" career?

But that's about as close to credible as you can get... and that's a long way away from it.

Gosh, you guys slay yourselves when allowed an open field to run.  Just like Obama and the Congressional Democrats now fighting among themselves over whether to torch the Public Option or disguise it or trigger it for a later day.

 

Nuance - it is an interesting concept.

Submitted by Mead50 on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 13:11.

We've got Mead 50 quoting commenters at other websites as proof that Soren's premise if (sic) wrong and flawed.

I know this might be difficult for you to grasp, but there are very often nuances in situations, particularly with regard to understanding the goings on in other countries. Is Soren an expert in German politics? If so, I apologize and withdraw my comment. If he is not, then I'm quite happy to let my comment stand, given that it includes two interesting perspectives that are well worth considering.

Just for once, just for fun, would you like to try to conjure up a reasoned and measured comment on something - one devoid of insults and personal attacks?

I notice

Submitted by NMDem on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 13:17.

I notice you don't bother to address my central point that the Teabaggers are far from being a grassroots movement, that they are, in fact, a product of the aforementioned front groups.  Obviously, the GOP is going to split into at least two parties, the far right kooks vs. the David Frum types.  And Frum goes down a whole lot better with Independents than Dick Armey does. 

Not even a windbag

Submitted by Freedoms Truth on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 23:53.

"we've the ultimate windbag of NMDem"Not even that. that's an insult to windbags.

He's an out and out troll, who has apparentely OD'd on the Daily Hate of dKos and his spreading his message of hate, infamy, and status quo politics-of-destruction by attacking any and all parts of the right.

My My...

Submitted by NMDem on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 01:44.

... what a tangled web you weave!  KOS?  Whatever.  No one mentioned him until you did.  I don't read him.  I usually read David Frum and Andrew Sullivan and I admire George Will although I rarely agree with him.  

I think these guys started this blog to nudge the party away from nuttiness and have found the comments have been hijacked by the wingers - and of course "trolls" like me.  But, they've allowed contributors like Soren Dayton who is just a literate version of Sarah Palin, so they have little to complain of.

I never would have known this blog existed if I hadn't read about it on Andrew's blog.   

I have fun here.

Henry Clay is calling out to you boys.  

It's kind of funny to watch NMDem squirm...

Submitted by JakeMountain1 on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 06:35.

and his troll-like pals in Mead, ClassicLib2, igm, Ray in Tx and a host of other curious "single-time" posters.

The funny thing is that now, having lost argument after argument, policy debate after policy debate, guys like Mead and NMDem are left quoting other commenters in other blogs because, on their own, they don't have the intellectual tools to develop ideas... they have to steal 'em from others.  Or, as NMDem does in this thread, quotes Rolling Stone magazine as an authoritative voice.

And guys like ClassicLibDem2 are left quoting DailyKos "polls" to prove their points --even though reason and facts get in the way of their spin.

If the Democrat Party left were better at thinking than merely agitating --as NMDem admits here-- my hunch is that public policy efforts like the Public Option wouldn't fail so miserably... even tho' they control both chambers of Congress, the White House, the MSM, 80% of AlGore's internet(s).

 

Mead 50, nuance has never been in your presence.

Submitted by MI-GOPer on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 13:33.

I have to laugh at that when others point out you're wrong, repeatedly wrong, on an issue you play the VictimCard and start complaining about unfair treatment or mean words.  Nope, Mead, you were the guy who quoted two "commenters" (sic) at other sites to suggest that Soren was wrong.  When you have an original idea that didn't spin off the press at the Democrat Underground, that'll be the event of the year.

And a first for all your comments on this blog.

NMDem, why would anyone take what you say seriously when you're quoting Rolling Stone as a reference.  Rolling Stone, on anything other than music and contemporary drug culture, is irrelevant.  Fluff.  Supermarket trash of the tabloid sort.  MSM dribble for dopeheads 24x7.

NMDem, you have no central point.  You have no argument to be discussed.  The last one you had was to drag the still-warm body of the murdered Census Worker into the arena for some low-balled attempt at partisan gamesmanship.  And that didn't work.

You were called on it by many.  Asked to apologize.  You didn't, haven't and I'm guessing here, won't.  You'd need a conscience for that --and character.  Both missing from your shallow gene pool.

"Commenter" means

Submitted by Mead50 on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 13:53.

"Commenter" means "one who makes or writes comments" - Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary. And if you have two of them, they are "commenters".

 

 

Quibble alert from the guy who's defining meaningless.

Submitted by MI-GOPer on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 15:23.

You have to be joking.  Like I said, give the Village Idiots some open field and they'll make fools of themselves all day long.

Sorry for quibbling

Submitted by Mead50 on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 16:49.

your quibble.

Angela

Submitted by rbottoms on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 13:46.

Congratulations.

Nice to hear the chancellor who thought George Bush was a dolt has been re-elected. Now she has an adult in the White House to work with without fear of unwanted back massages.

 

And the guy who thinks Obama is 'weak' is doing a great job too

Submitted by Freedoms Truth on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 23:36.

 

"Now she has an adult in the White House to work with"

- Whoever, that is, it aint the naive boyish President we have now, who gives a way the store for worthless words from a despot.

 

 

What German elections (apparently) don't teach us

Submitted by johnson springs on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 14:44.

The problem with labels like right, left and center is that they are, of course, relative and vary from nation to nation and culture to culture. From the NY Times:

Europe’s center-right parties have embraced many ideas of the left: generous welfare benefits, nationalized health care, sharp restrictions on carbon emissions, the ceding of some sovereignty to the European Union. But they have won votes by promising to deliver more efficiently than the left, while working to lower taxes, improve financial regulation, and grapple with aging populations.

Europe’s conservatives, says Michel Winock, a historian at the Paris Institut d’Études Politiques, “have adapted themselves to modernity.” When Nicolas Sarkozy of France and Germany’s Angela Merkel condemn the excesses of the “Anglo-Saxon model” of capitalism while praising the protective power of the state, they are using Socialist ideas that have become mainstream, he said.

So, Europe's conservatives would be edging to the left of Obama as near as I can tell. What lesson would one care to draw from that?

So, Europe's conservatives

Submitted by rbottoms on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 14:59.

So, Europe's conservatives would be edging to the left of Obama as near as I can tell. What lesson would one care to draw from that?

That the American Right are a screaming bunch of fruitcakes who can simultaniously praise Germany's conservative government while denouncing introduction in America of government solutions that the German Chancellor herself wholeheartedly supports as socialism.

"You've got to remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know... morons."

~ Blazing Saddles

 

 

Something else

Submitted by classicliberal2 on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 16:04.

That the American Right are a screaming bunch of fruitcakes who can simultaniously praise Germany's conservative government while denouncing introduction in America of government solutions that the German Chancellor herself wholeheartedly supports as socialism.

I found it a little disturbing to see praise for an alleged shift to the right in Germany anyway. The last time there was an economic crisis and Germany shifted to the right, it cost the world somewhere on the order of 60 million dead.

The last time there was an

Submitted by rbottoms on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 16:09.

The last time there was an economic crisis and Germany shifted to the right, it cost the world somewhere on the order of 60 million dead.

Hyperbole much?

Leftwingers hate patriotic Americans

Submitted by Freedoms Truth on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 20:46.

This comment and thousands like it on leftie blogs, dripping with contempt for that portion of Americans that dares to disagree with them, tells me this:

The American Left are a screaming bunch of a-holes who just hate that 'silent majority' of Americans that are normal, patriotic, flag-waving, freedom-loving, God-believing, non-leftists.

 

 

We don't hate you, we just

Submitted by rbottoms on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 22:29.

We don't hate you, we just think you're stupid.

We're not laughing with you.

We're laughing at you, for voting twice for a president whose big achievement is starting and working very hard to lose a trillion dollars fighting a war over weapons that didn't exist. And also for watching you whine about how he durn fooled ya.

For believing the Earth is 4,000 years old.

For fashioning your party to work on the intellectual level of plumbers.

For thinking that being a member of The Sons of the Confederacy is a positive.

For paying $30 for a fax and bumper sticker to protest that the president was born in Nigeria, or Kenya, or Indionesia or something.

For shaping up the 2012 contest to be between a distinguised Harvard graduate and a moose hunting mayor from Alaska and her vice-presidential mate, a faith-healing exorcist who sounds like Urkel, or a Mormon who you secretly think is really going to Hell when he passes.

Suckers, Boobs. Raging militia nuts, truly the soul of the GOP.

 

 

 

 

An arrogant jerk leftist checks in

Submitted by Freedoms Truth on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 23:45.

Thanks for making my point, with a tirade and a litany of elistist prejudicial nonsense as cartoonish and ignorant as the beliefs you claim to mock.  

For fashioning your party to work on the intellectual level of plumbers.

... disdaining the very voters you claim to represent.

... mocking and disdaining Christian faith.

... playing the race card incessently.

... bashing your opponents with ad hominems.

You have nothing left but your disdain and hate and contempt for ordinary Americans.

Meanwhile its your side that fell for Obama's ObamaCare will actually not increase the deficit and other stupidities too long to mention.

.. disdaining the very voters

Submitted by rbottoms on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 01:32.

.. disdaining the very voters you claim to represent.

I haven't been elected to represent anyone.

... mocking and disdaining Christian faith.

Not Christans as any sane person would recongnize the term, just snake handling exorcists. I've been a Christian probably longer than you've been on this planet.

... playing the race card incessently.

Whatever my feelings are on race I've earned them as a part of a family that sent a young husband off to war, to defend this country despite having to ride the Jim Crow car to Washington to get his officer's commision back in World War II. And personally through my own 13 years of service in the Army protecting blowhards like Jonah Goldberg, Newt Gingrich, Dick Cheney, and Glenn Beck. Something the Chickenhawk armchair warriors of the 101st Chairborne big talkers brigade haven't bothered to do.

... bashing your opponents with ad hominems.

So the Earth is 4,000 years old and Fred Flintstone rode dinasaurs to work? It's a free country and you may worship as you please, speak in charismatic tounges or whatever the heck it is you choose to believe.

Meanwhile its your side that fell for Obama's ObamaCare will actually not increase the deficit and other stupidities too long to mention.

Oh you mean government run single payer health care like in Anglea Merkle's Germany? I personally wouldn't have any problem with it having spent 10 years stationed in Germany and seen first hand how my wife was treated when she was ill. No we won't haven't anything as common sense as that in the USA due to the bed wetting fear of socialism your side yammers on about incessantly. But what we do get will be fine for a start.

Distain for the moose tracking plumbers and proudly uneducated common folk? Plenty. But only because you're all so proud of being uninformed, not like those elite snobs who get degrees from someplace other than ITT Tech or Ronald McDonald U.

 

Bottom boi says...

Submitted by JakeMountain1 on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 06:46.

I've been a Christian probably longer than you've been on this planet.

It's scarey to think that you might be older than 14 because I've been dismissing most of your edgey rants as juvenile dribble of someone with neither life experiences or enough common sense to appreciate reality beyond his basic teenager needs.

To think that you might be older than 14 is frightening. 

To think that you consider yourself a Christian is dumb-founding; I don't think I've ever read anything from you that would even remotely suggest you share the values of Christ or conduct yourself in any moral fashion.

Wow.  Utterly astounding, bottom boi.

 

Newsmax columnist John Perry

Submitted by rbottoms on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 11:06.

Newsmax columnist John Perry wrote Tuesday that President Obama "is inviting" a military coup" and that it might not be such a bad thing: "Imagine a bloodless coup to restore and defend the Constitution through an interim administration that would do the serious business of governing and defending the nation. Skilled, military-trained, nation-builders would replace accountability-challenged, radical-left commissars." (Newsmax appears to have taken the column down.)

On the same day conservative talk-radio host Jim Quinn directly addressed U.S. troops, telling them that Obama is "gonna get you killed."

 

The GOP is a bastion of whiney gutsless, treasonous purveyors of sedition and agitation of violence against the president. Aided and abetted by Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh, and Sean Hannity their daily spew will come home to roost at the ballot box.

And now the 14 yr olds are quoting Huffington Post

Submitted by meechigan-matt on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 11:54.

the extremist radical Left wing blog that makes Daily Kos look reasonable and sane.

Bottoms, you hit rock bottom again. What a putz (trans. for bottoms, that's fool)

American style conservatives in Germany

Submitted by lgm on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 19:20.

It’s true that we should not compare the party of Merkel to US conservatives.  They have little in common, besides having more of the public to the left of them than to the right.There are American style conservatives in Germany -- global warming denying, immigrant bashing, “Merkel = Stalin” puffing, war on Christmas and marriage fretting, … . The difference is that in Germany they are the far right fringe with no mainstream credibility and single digit support.   

Just saying something

Submitted by NMDem on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 15:27.

doesn't make it so.  My central point was and is to comment on the validity of the Teabaggers as a genuine  "movement" when evidence mounts to the contrary.  And, I think if you READ my first comment I indicated that there need be no music tabloid come to newstands to tell anybody who has cared enough to know that this Teabagger farce was ginned-up fiction. 

As to the horrific lynching of Mr. Sparkman, I have no intention of apologizing to anyone for making a link between that act and the anti-govenrment rants from Fox/Right Wing Extremist Radio, etc.  O'Reilly killed Dr. Tiller just as sure as if he pulled the trigger himself.  I am more than prepared to lay Mr. Sparkman's killing at the feet of Michele Bachman.  These people have to be held accountable for their acts.

And, as typical for Republicanist behavior, you engage in character assassination instead of debate.

Leftist smear artists

Submitted by Freedoms Truth on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 20:57.

"you engage in character assassination instead of debate."

What a hypocrite. You refer to patriots protesting for fiscal responsibility with a gay sex act term, a term ONLY LEFTISTS USE to demean the Tea Party movement.

You are more than prepared to lie about members of Congress because it's suits your lunatic paranoid views, and your guilt-by-association political games.

... you dare accuse others of character assassination?!? What a putz!

"These people have to be held accountable for their acts."

And your own acts of dishonesty, character assassination will some day come back and haunt you.

What a putz! Oops.

Submitted by rbottoms on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 22:36.

What a putz!

Oops. Fail.

Noun 1. putz - (Yiddish) a fool; an idiotYiddish - a dialect of High German including some Hebrew and other words; spoken in Europe as a vernacular by many Jews; written in the Hebrew scriptfool, muggins, saphead, tomfool, sap - a person who lacks good judgment
  2. putz - obscene terms for penis              pecker, cock, dick, peter, prick, tool, shaftpenis, phallus, member - the male organ of copulation (`member' is a euphemism)dirty word, vulgarism, obscenity, smut, filth - an offensive or indecent word or phrase

 

 

Another libtard fail moment

Submitted by Freedoms Truth on Tue, 09/29/2009 - 23:49.

...  if you think that deranged leftist poster doesnt deserve to be called a putz for a litany of character assassinations followed by a whine/claim against same ... you are a putz too.

Actually bottom boi, he nailed you as a putz

Submitted by JakeMountain1 on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 07:06.

and used the word correctly... and with you it fits as a fool.  If there was a Yiddish phrase that encompassed a juvenile fool, Freedoms Truth would have been even more accurate.

As one who grew up in a home that used Yiddish phrases alot

Submitted by meechigan-matt on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 11:03.

the use of putz by Freedoms Truth is correct and, regretably, very acurate and appropriate.

Nope, NMDem, you left decency behind a while ago...

Submitted by JakeMountain1 on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 06:57.

when you tried to use the Census worker's death for a cheap partisan gain and then repeat and expand that claim here --again.  The guy's body wasn't even laid to rest yet and you were dragging him through the streets to parade your own lunatic fringe fantasy that he was slaughtered by anti-govt redneck backwoodsmen who probably voted Republican.

Of course, you've already been proven wrong on all those points.

Failure to apologize simply means you're not worthy of anyone's respect here.  It's nothing personal, NMDem... it's just civilized people need to keep barbarians and sociopaths like you outside of decent people.  That you're a Democrat radical isn't a surprise.  That you're an atheist isn't a surprise either.  That you think your comments merit attention, that' just your self-delusion parading as a defense.

Be a man.  Admit you were wrong to use Mr Sparkman's death in such a disrespectful and callous manner.  You may think that Bill OReilly's expose killed Tiller, but that's a different story. 

As you said above:

... people have to be held accountable for their acts.

Apologize with a sense of sincere atonement for a horrendously uncilivized outburst.

 

Expose?

Submitted by NMDem on Thu, 10/01/2009 - 10:41.

You call O'Reilly's relentless rants an expose?  Sinclair Lewis writing about meatpacking was an expose.  O'Reilly's actions were a campaign for assassination. 

As to Mr. Sparkman's lynching, how can you possibly draw any other conclusion from the facts as we know them that it was anything other than an anti-government act of terrorism?  To say otherwise is to live in the same camp as that cross-eyed fool Virginia Fox who said Matthew Shepard's murder was the result of a robbery. 

I will never apologize for calling attention to Mr. Sparkman's execution by the right wing.  His blood is on Michelle Bachman's hands.  Period.  Your calls for me to apologize are laughable in light of the daily treasonous rants from the right wing, including news yesterday of a wingnut site advocating a military coup against the President, as noted above by Mr. Bottoms, whom you derisvely refer to as "Bottom Boy", a one two punch of a gay and black slur at the same time.  Class acts, all of you. 

It's clear the right wing wants a Second Civil War in this country and I for one will be happy to oblige them.  It's been a real eye-opener to me to discover how many of my liberal friends are gun owners like myself. Don't delude yourselves into thinking that we won't bash back. 

Shame on NMDem; he's placed well beyond contempt now

Submitted by JakeMountain1 on Fri, 10/02/2009 - 13:09.

First off, we don't know what happened to Mr Sparkman, the Census worker and part-time teacher.  To date, the local police, the country sheriff, the Kentucky State Police, the FBI and the Natl Park Service Special Investigation Group have been careful NOT to draw conclusions... it's called good police work, my immoral hyperventilating windbag friend.

I'm certain the authorities and prosecutors will be able to sort out what happened to Mr Sparkman in that area of Kentucky even if that area of eastern Kentucky is increasingly pro-Democrat, rife with illicit drug manufacturing enterprises and corruption on a grander scale than even Chicago.

The point I and others object to is your use of Mr Sparkman's death --even before his body was cold-- for cheap political gain.  That's the point --not your mouth-foaming conspiracy rants.

Using Mr Sparkman's death is immoral, you windbag.  It's beyond contempt.  You have no decency.  You have no shame, either.

The only thing you should be laying at anybody's feet is an apology, your well-earned shame and a touch of sincere atonement.  That you can't and, in fact, repeat the immoral accusations underscores what a scumbag Democrat blogThug you trolls can be.

And it doesn't help the case that others Democrat trolls who comment very --maybe too much so-- frequently can't find the decency to call you out for a well-earned apology.

 

Shepard's killer was on meth.

Submitted by noufa on Fri, 10/02/2009 - 15:01.

Yet NMDem looks at the murder & concludes right-wing homophobia was the problem.

How do you feel about the war on drugs, NMDem?

you are a putz too. Talk

Submitted by rbottoms on Wed, 09/30/2009 - 01:35.

you are a putz too.

Talk about unclear on the concept.